January 1999 - XEmacs-Beta - XEmacs Mailing List Archives

Adrian Aichner

>>>>> "Andy" == Andy Piper <andyp(a)parallax.co.uk> writes: Andy> I finally got around to enhancing pop3.el. This does UIDL Andy> support + my regexp partial downloading and is reasonable Andy> quick to boot. I will probably put this into mail-lib if Andy> no-one has any objections. Andy> Merry Christmas Adrian ... Hello Andy, thanks for the Christmas peresent! I only unwrapped it yesterday due to an extended, unplugged, vacation. I did not take this pop3.el but droppped the contents of the pop3.el patch from your mlpop.patch into mail-lib/pop3.el instead (removing the leading +s). I then byte-compiled it. Andy> andy Andy> - pop3.el I verified with locate-library that I am finding mail-lib/pop3.elc and not c:\Program Files\xemacs\xemacs-packages\pgnus-0.66\lisp\pop3.elc My initial attempts to pop mail after setting[1] '(nnmail-movemail-program (quote nnmail-pop3-movemail)) failed until I set '(pop3-leave-mail-on-server t t) as well. This works great now, thanks! This leaves the nit against pgnus-0.66 (and older versions) that it always prompts for the pop password, instead of caching it. Do you already have a solution for that? Will you advertise your pop3.el to Lars for inclusion into pgnus? Thanks again, Adrian Andy> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Andy> " .sigs are like your face - rarely seen by you and uglier than you think" Andy> Dr Andy Piper, Technical Architect, Parallax Solutions Ltd Andy> mail: andyp(a)parallax.co.uk web: www.parallax.co.uk/~andyp Footnotes: [1] inside (custom-set-variables ...) in .emacs -- Adrian Aichner European Design Center Teradyne GmbH Semiconductor Test Group Telephone +49/89/41861(0)-208 Dingolfinger Strasse 2 Fax +49/89/41861-217 (What is a Fax?) D-81673 MUENCHEN E-mail adrian.aichner(a)teradyne.com

3 participants
4 comments

Re: BAD BAD bloat (was Re: What to do with modules now ...) 25 years, 5 months

Peter Windle

J. Kean Johnston writes: : On Wed, Jan 13, 1999 at 09:00:31PM -0800, Kyle Jones wrote: : > If I can run today's XEmacs on a machine that is five : > years old (I can and do) and on the cheapest PC's available : > today, then I think we're doing all right. So I don't see in-core : > memory size as an issue worth addressing, unless its something : > we can do easily. : : Your argument holds true only if that is ALL you are doing. I : refuse to believe that you can run a fully laden XEmacs, have a : compile (or maybe even two) going, have a web server running, and : a few ftp sessions active (a fairly typical scenario on a typical : Linux workstation), all in 32MB of memory. I've managed to do some fairly serious development on a 32Mb P233 Linux box with X, XEmacs, make and egcs going full tilt. I think this is entirely an reasonable "maximum load" for this class of machine, and it's eminently possible to get things done. I'd hate to think about using DevStudio and NT on a box that piffling.... Cheers, -- pete "..."

1 participants
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Re: private colormap in XEmacs? 25 years, 5 months

Jareth Hein

>>>>> "Hrvoje" == Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic(a)srce.hr> writes: Hrvoje> Holger Schauer <schauer(a)coling.uni-freiburg.de> writes: Have Hrvoje> you tried `xemacs -private'? It should work in 21.0 and Hrvoje> later. Actually, the full option is -privatecolormap... >> This is currently not documented in the manpage. Hrvoje> It should be added. I'll do something about it. >> Is there a corresponding xresource-setting ? Yes. The resource is .privateColormap, which also goes hand-in-hand with the -visual (.EmacsVisual) option(Xresource). Actually, I think those are in 20.4... (I did those over a year ago...) -- Jareth Hein | jareth(a)camelot.co.jp | ハインジェラス Toolsmith & Program lead | http://www.camelot.co.jp | 開発部チーフ Camelot Software, Ltd. | |（株）キャメロット "It's a sad sign of the times when 'political machine' is redefined to include 'main-line battle tank'" - Ambassador Grossblunder

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xemacs 21.0.62 and desktop library 25 years, 5 months

Markus Pietrek

Hi folks, i´m new at this mailing list. Lately I installed xemacs-21.0.62 and can´t find the desktop library to save the list of loaded buffers at program end and reload them at start. I have looked in the additional packages and can´t find it their, too. Is it renamed ,replaced or just hidden anywhere? Let me say that xemacs was and is the best editor i know. And now it is more easily configurable. Go on with that good work! ------------- Our OS who art in CPU, UNIX by thy name, Thy programs run, thy syscalls done, In kernel as it is in user. (not by me) Markus Pietrek Homepage: http://members.xoom.com/pietrek

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Beware of modules. 25 years, 5 months

Olivier Galibert

The current discussion about breaking up XEmacs in modules is interesting, but imhnso loses a bit when confronted to reality. Lemme remind you some basic facts of life: 1- Modules are slow. Modules must be compiled as a position independant code in order to be loadable dynamically. This is particularily bad on x86 where it hogs one register for that and hence forces the compiler to generate much less efficient code. I plan to fix that for linux in the future, but it will be a 2.3 project, and linux isn't the only OS out there. Calls to module functions can't be inlined. This, in particular, concerns Mule. Don't even _think_ about changing the current Mule macros to function calls. Or be ready to crawl. 2- Module versioning is a pain Given the current state of the code we can't expect a module to work with anything else than the executable it was compiled with (count the #ifdefs in the source). This is btw more or less the same situation than with the linux kernel. Because of that, the first problem is going to be "I downloaded XEmacs 21.6.66 and it crashes at startup - Did you check the module versions ? - Ooops sorry, there was an old condom.so there from XEmacs 21.4.2". The other problem is how to install two different versions of XEmacs simultaneously. And no, I do not mean to different version numbers. I usually have on irix 4 or 5 differently compiled XEmacs executables (with/without debugging, with/without mule, with/without gung-ho, and my personally hacked versions). All the lisp and lib-src files are shared between all of them. 3- Modules and undumping aren't really compatible Undumping requires loading a lot of lisp. Said lisp uses most of the functions that would end up in modules, hence all the modules will have to be loaded. Worse, the data and bss sections of these modules will have references to the lisp code. Do we want to write a module undumper? 4- Bloat is in the eye of the beholder Sorry to say that, but "I dont buy the argument that everything that is unused is swapped either" shows a lack of understanding of modern VMs. Unused code or data isn't swapped, it isn't loaded at all. And code pages or unmodified data pages aren't swapped but discarded. I also fail to see in which way having a 3.1Mb executable and a 1.1Mb module is any better than having a 4Mb executable including both (indirect calls to functions, lack of inlining and alignment constraints in .so have both a speed and a size cost). OG.

2 participants
4 comments

Re: hack-package-index.el (batch-hack-package-index) 25 years, 5 months

SL Baur

David Walter <david(a)eaglepeak.i-did-not-set--mail-host-address--so-shoot-me> writes in xemacs-beta(a)xemacs.org: Hmm. It might be a good idea if you add (setq mail-host-address "syr.edu") somewhere in your setup. > Martin Buchholz <martin(a)xemacs.org> writes: >> >>>>> "David" == David Walter <dwalter(a)syr.edu> writes: >> David> In the changelog I find a reference to: David> hack-package-index.el (batch-hack-package-index) >> David> and in XEmacs.rules in the packages directory I find a reference to David> these as well. >> David> I don't find the file after checking out the sources though. >> >> Exactly the same thing happened to me. >> >> I then did a cvs update, and voila, more files - including the >> critical missing one. >> >> So, it seems CVS is not entirely reliable? > I have now tried this also, but alas. > Did you use a release tag on your update command? Don't do that. A simple `cvs update hack-package-index.el' in the top-level directory will fetch the correct file. I believe that Jareth needs to add this to the glue module.

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Re: hack-package-index.el (batch-hack-package-index) 25 years, 5 months

David Walter

Martin Buchholz <martin(a)xemacs.org> writes: > >>>>> "David" == David Walter <dwalter(a)syr.edu> writes: > > David> In the changelog I find a reference to: > David> hack-package-index.el (batch-hack-package-index) > > David> and in XEmacs.rules in the packages directory I find a reference to > David> these as well. > > David> I don't find the file after checking out the sources though. > > Exactly the same thing happened to me. > > I then did a cvs update, and voila, more files - including the > critical missing one. > > So, it seems CVS is not entirely reliable? I have now tried this also, but alas. Did you use a release tag on your update command? Thanks -- Respectfully: David Walter Karma: Whenever you are there you go. dwalter(a)syr.edu

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Re: Deleting broken in Python, or why delete-key-deletes-forward sucks 25 years, 5 months

Hrvoje Niksic

"Barry A. Warsaw" <bwarsaw(a)cnri.reston.va.us> writes: > Hrvoje> Python is very cool. It's a shame it doesn't have lexical > Hrvoje> closures, though. Even the four-letter-P-word "language" > Hrvoje> has them. > > Sorry, I don't know what that last bit means... :-) { my $foo = 3; sub bar { $foo; } } # $foo no longer in scope print &bar (); Can I do that in Python? These things are very important in some cases, especially with anonymous functions ("closures") used as callbacks to widget functions. > The standard Python response is "use a class". Awww...

2 participants
1 comments

Re: Deleting broken in Python, or why delete-key-deletes-forward sucks 25 years, 5 months

Hrvoje Niksic

"Barry A. Warsaw" <bwarsaw(a)cnri.reston.va.us> writes: > >>>>> "Hrvoje" == Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic(a)srce.hr> writes: > > Hrvoje> The standard XEmacs way of recognizing this can > Hrvoje> look like this: > > Somewhere along the way (possibly b/w XEmacs 20 and 21, possibly > after I unsub'd from the list ;-) the blessed way of doing this > changed. The punch-line of this joke is that I'm not sure what the blessed way of doing this is. The `delete-forward-p' function isn't even documented! And it's (probably unnecessarily) inlined, which means it will screw all the existing byte-compiled code as soon as we change its definition. > Thanks for helping be uncover a bug in my Exceed setup, and Hrvoje, > it's good to see you hacking Python! :-) For the former, I don't understand; for the latter, you're welcome. :-) Python is very cool. It's a shame it doesn't have lexical closures, though. Even the four-letter-P-word "language" has them.

2 participants
1 comments

Re: enhanced pop3.el 25 years, 5 months

Adrian Aichner

>>>>> "Andy" == Andy Piper <andyp(a)parallax.co.uk> writes: Andy> At 14:14 14/01/99 +0100, Adrian Aichner wrote: >> My initial attempts to pop mail after setting[1] >> '(nnmail-movemail-program (quote nnmail-pop3-movemail)) >> failed until I set >> '(pop3-leave-mail-on-server t t) >> as well. Andy> You mean it doesn't work when destructively downloading mail from the Andy> server? This is a bug if so. It didn't retrieve anything until I set pop3-leave-mail-on-server t even though mail was waiting. Could this be a bug of the Lotus Notes POP server? >> This leaves the nit against pgnus-0.66 (and older versions) that it >> always prompts for the pop password, instead of caching it. >> >> Do you already have a solution for that? Andy> I'll crib the stuff of epop3 - it does this already. Great! Lars may work on this feature also (he promised to). >> Will you advertise your pop3.el to Lars for inclusion into pgnus? Andy> Have done. No response to date. You pop3.el has worked dandy to date! Thanks, Adrian -- Adrian Aichner European Design Center Teradyne GmbH Semiconductor Test Group Telephone +49/89/41861(0)-208 Dingolfinger Strasse 2 Fax +49/89/41861-217 (What is a Fax?) D-81673 MUENCHEN E-mail adrian.aichner(a)teradyne.com

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XEmacs-Beta January 1999