6:11 a.m.
Shouldn't a useful debugging tool like featurep be interactive, or
have an interactive version?
--
Institute of Policy and Planning Sciences http://turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp
University of Tsukuba Tennodai 1-1-1 Tsukuba 305-8573 JAPAN
Don't ask how you can "do" free software business;
ask what your business can "do for" free software.
10:41 a.m.
M-x eval-expression<RET>(featurep 'mule)<RET>
Result is displayed in the echo area. Or evaluate directly in *scratch*
No need to introduce interactive wrappers for *technical* stuff.
Nick.
intro: "SJT" == Stephen J Turnbull <stephen(a)xemacs.org> writes:
SJT> Shouldn't a useful debugging tool like featurep be interactive, or have
SJT> an interactive version?
SJT> From: "A. L. Meyers"
<nospam.look(a)replyto.because.this.is.invalid>
SJT> Subject: Re: How to turn off ^M end of line in buffers? Newsgroups:
SJT> comp.emacs.xemacs Date: 21 Apr 2002 07:49:07 +0200 Organization: Meyers
SJT> Consulting http://www.consult-meyers.com Reply-To: "A. Lucien Meyers"
SJT> <a.l.meyers(a)consult-meyers.com>
SJT> Nix <nix-razor-pit(a)esperi.demon.co.uk> writes:
> On 20 Apr 2002, A. L. Meyers stipulated:
> > See ^M end of line markers in text and elisp files. How can one make
> > them invisible permanently? Can't find the appropriate customize group.
>
> If your XEmacs is compiled with file-coding or MULE support, they'll
> vanish automatically, as XEmacs will detect the appropriate end-of-line
> encoding for new files as they are opened.
>
> What does (featurep 'file-coding) return? How about (featurep 'mule)?
SJT> Sorry, but I don't know how (or where) to enter these commands. e. g.
SJT> doing M-x and typing featurep gets me nowhere.
SJT> Lucien -- If you receive this by error, please delete it and inform the
SJT> sender. PGP key fingerprint=F1C0 D9AE 1B18 1405 4DFA B4CC 6DC7 FF78
SJT> C76E FB15 To Big Brother Echelon from "spook": terrorist Blair
SJT> supercomputer NORAD SDI SEAL Team 6 FSF Bush sentiero ----------
SJT> -- Institute of Policy and Planning Sciences
SJT> http://turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp University of Tsukuba Tennodai 1-1-1
SJT> Tsukuba 305-8573 JAPAN Don't ask how you can "do" free software
SJT> business; ask what your business can "do for" free software.
1:03 p.m.
"Stephen J. Turnbull" <stephen(a)xemacs.org> writes:
Shouldn't a useful debugging tool like featurep be interactive,
or
have an interactive version?
I don't think it makes sense to pollute the command namespace with
stuff that will only ever be needed for debugging. It's not *that*
hard to enter M-: (featurep 'foo).
1:42 p.m.
>>>> "Hrvoje" == Hrvoje Niksic
<hniksic(a)arsdigita.com> writes:
Hrvoje> "Stephen J. Turnbull" <stephen(a)xemacs.org> writes:
> Shouldn't a useful debugging tool like featurep be
interactive,
> or have an interactive version?
Hrvoje> I don't think it makes sense to pollute the command
Hrvoje> namespace with stuff that will only ever be needed for
Hrvoje> debugging. It's not *that* hard to enter M-: (featurep
Hrvoje> 'foo).
OK. We'll just have to train "our staff on c.e.x" to say so, since
we're getting a fair number of people who do stuff like M-x featurep,
and it doesn't work for them.
And maybe provide a diagnose package with this stuff in menus.
--
Institute of Policy and Planning Sciences http://turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp
University of Tsukuba Tennodai 1-1-1 Tsukuba 305-8573 JAPAN
Don't ask how you can "do" free software business;
ask what your business can "do for" free software.
2:16 p.m.
On 22 Apr 2002, stephen(a)xemacs.org wrote:
>>>>> "Hrvoje" == Hrvoje Niksic
<hniksic(a)arsdigita.com> writes:
Hrvoje> "Stephen J. Turnbull" <stephen(a)xemacs.org> writes:
>> Shouldn't a useful debugging tool like featurep be interactive,
>> or have an interactive version?
Hrvoje> I don't think it makes sense to pollute the command
Hrvoje> namespace with stuff that will only ever be needed for
Hrvoje> debugging. It's not *that* hard to enter M-: (featurep
Hrvoje> 'foo).
OK. We'll just have to train "our staff on c.e.x" to say so, since
we're getting a fair number of people who do stuff like M-x featurep,
and it doesn't work for them.
When playing around with new features that I run across I often wind
up starting to type M-x require <feature>, before I remember that
require is not interactive. Things like feature and require that deal
with the lisp 'environment' should be interactive. maybe.
And maybe provide a diagnose package with this stuff in menus.
Not quite sure where you mean here...
-jeff
5:46 p.m.
Jeff Mincy <jeff(a)delphioutpost.com> writes:
> OK. We'll just have to train "our staff on c.e.x"
to say so, since
> we're getting a fair number of people who do stuff like M-x
> featurep, and it doesn't work for them.
When playing around with new features that I run across I often wind
up starting to type M-x require <feature>, before I remember that
require is not interactive. Things like feature and require that
deal with the lisp 'environment' should be interactive. maybe.
Use `M-x load-file' and `M-x load-library' which accept strings and
are meant to be interactive.
11:38 p.m.
On Mon, 22 Apr 2002, hniksic(a)arsdigita.com wrote:
Jeff Mincy <jeff(a)delphioutpost.com> writes:
>> OK. We'll just have to train "our staff on c.e.x" to say so,
since
>> we're getting a fair number of people who do stuff like M-x
>> featurep, and it doesn't work for them.
>
> When playing around with new features that I run across I often wind
> up starting to type M-x require <feature>, before I remember that
> require is not interactive. Things like feature and require that
> deal with the lisp 'environment' should be interactive. maybe.
Use `M-x load-file' and `M-x load-library' which accept strings and
are meant to be interactive.
Yea, except that load-library doesn't test to see if you have already
loaded the file. When loading features in your init file, it is a
better idea to load the features like (require 'mic-paren) rather than
(load-library "mic-paren") so that you don't reload files needlessly.
It just doesn't occur to me to mentally shift over to using
load-library for interactive usage - I understand the function
load-library just fine (although the doc string for load-library isn't
the most descriptive - "Load the library")
Anyway, whatever you think...
-jeff
11:49 p.m.
Jeff Mincy <jeff(a)delphioutpost.com> writes:
>> When playing around with new features that I run across I
often
>> wind up starting to type M-x require <feature>, before I remember
>> that require is not interactive. Things like feature and require
>> that deal with the lisp 'environment' should be interactive.
>> maybe.
>
> Use `M-x load-file' and `M-x load-library' which accept strings and
> are meant to be interactive.
Yea, except that load-library doesn't test to see if you have already
loaded the file.
But when using interactively, one usually *doesn't* want that kind of
check.
better idea to load the features like (require 'mic-paren) rather
than
(load-library "mic-paren") so that you don't reload files
needlessly.
Sure, but that's not interactive use. Note that I didn't say, "use
(load-library ...)". I said, "use M-x load-library ...".
It just doesn't occur to me to mentally shift over to using
load-library for interactive usage
I'm afraid such shifts are sometimes necessary because of the
different nature of interactive and noninteractive use. Something
like the famous next-line -> forward-line difference.
12:29 a.m.
On 22 Apr 2002, Stephen J. Turnbull said:
OK. We'll just have to train "our staff on c.e.x" to
say so
So trained :)
(I meant to mention M-:, honest...)
--
`Unless they've moved it since I last checked, travelling between
England and America does not involve crossing the equator.'
--- pir
8047
days inactive
8047
days old
8 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
-
Hrvoje Niksic -
Jeff Mincy -
Nickolay Pakoulin -
Nix -
Stephen J. Turnbull