Hmmm.... I've noticed comp.emacs.xemacs becoming a second-class citizen over the years. It's the only newsgroup for XEmacs announcements and it gets few of those (this wasn't the case in the past). Also, it appears that a number of messages are responded to by e-mail, leaving everyone else out of the discussion. When relying only on comp.emacs.xemacs, I found myself confused about what the latest XEmacs non-beta release was, particularly when non-beta releases acquired patch numbers. The www.xemacs.org hasn't been much help. For instance, today it says: "Current Version: 21.1, released May 14, 1999". Clicking on the link, we find a directory with 21.1.2 through 21.1.4. Only 21.1.2 seems dated in May. Are the other versions beta? Eventually I learned that everything in that FTP directory is non-beta, by definition. Recently I saw an announcement for a beta release in xemacs-announce. I don't have a copy of the message but the announcement looked like a non-beta announcement except for the fact that the word "beta" appeared in an obscure spot. Anyway, this is just a view from the outside. I finally signed up for xemacs, xemacs-announce, xemacs-beta and xemacs-nt even though I'm really only interested in non-beta releases. I've gotten a lot more useful information this way. I'd like to propose some simple solutions (in terms of effort) that would improve the situation for non-beta people. 1) When you mail a non-beta announcement to xemacs-announce, cc: it to xemacs(a)xemacs.org. I can start forwarding these announcements, but it would reduce duplication if the originator would do so. 2) If you are replying to a question in the xemacs mailing list (or equivalently, the comp.emacs.xemacs newsgroup) try to respond to the entire list rather than just the individual. And many thanks to those that are already doing so. I learn a lot from you. 3) When releasing a non-beta XEmacs, update the www.xemacs.org main page to be as specific as possible. For instance, I would say: "Current Version: 21.1.4, released July 8, 1999". Thanks for your help. -- Antonio Freixas tonyf(a)ims.com (503) 626-5433