"Stephen J. Turnbull" <turnbull(a)sk.tsukuba.ac.jp&gt; writes: ??? Stephen, you misunderstand the issues. The code users will ever see simply uses the Customize functions, which know what to do with the symbols. There is noi reason any user should know anything about the `standard-value' property. What you are talking about is the stability of the *concept* of "standard value", which is of course cast in stone. -- Hrvoje Niksic <hniksic(a)srce.hr&gt; | Student at FER Zagreb, Croatia --------------------------------+-------------------------------- What is mind? No matter. What is matter? Never mind.