9:08 a.m.
Andreas Röhler writes:
It looks clever and it is to the extent, you still know
what's happening. But why all this bugs over the years
then?
It's a doubly recursive acronym: BUGS Unify GNU Systems.
= = = =
More seriously, Emacs is buggy because it's a large collection of
hacks, and it is deliberately set up to make quick hacks work pretty
well rather than help you create robust applications. XEmacs shares
those problems to a great extent, but has a somewhat larger component
of "design before building" philosophy.
> > However, that value might be overridden by
> > `lisp-mode-variables' which uses a hard-coded value.
>
> You should look into using a specifier for this variable.
[snip]
> The main problem with this scheme is that there is no `mode'
locale,
> but it wouldn't be hard to add it, I think.
I just did this by the way. I haven't tried to build it yet, time to
go to bed, but I should be able to report on it tomorrow.
Steve
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11:42 a.m.
New subject: No. 232 - indent-new-comment-line misbehaviour
Am Mittwoch, 12. März 2008 10:08 schrieb Stephen J. Turnbull:
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Andreas Röhler writes:
> It looks clever and it is to the extent, you still know
> what's happening. But why all this bugs over the years
> then?
It's a doubly recursive acronym: BUGS Unify GNU Systems.
= = = =
More seriously, Emacs is buggy because it's a large collection of
hacks, and it is deliberately set up to make quick hacks work pretty
well rather than help you create robust applications.
Let me describe situation with a common-life's example:
it's a known phenomenon: the most pretty girls are not
the most wanted for marriage.
With Emacs now we have definitely the most pretty; from
which one may conclude: Emacs hackers might not be the
most wisely in computing. As this includes me, please
no-one should feel offended by this remark. :)
To take a symbol already introduced: Probably we _have_
affair with a kind of Greta Garbo.
But then I say: Look, Greta, you are the most beautiful
in the world, even people who hate you, love you. But
it's not to deny: you are a couple of years in this
world now. Why not behave mannerly as a grand dame?
Why not say "Hello" when you meet a person?
Why not use a handkerchief?
Or: Why not make the basement of this marvellous
universe of code a little bit more reliable?
Grüße
Andreas Röhler
[snip][snip][snip]
11:52 p.m.
New subject: No. 232 - indent-new-comment-line misbehaviour
Andreas Röhler writes:
Or: Why not make the basement of this marvellous
universe of code a little bit more reliable?
Because Richard Stallman likes it the way it is. Look up the history
of `split-string'. He absolutely insisted on special-casing the
default case because that's what a hacker would want most of the time.
This kind of thing happens all the time.
We're constrained by compatibility with split-string and other common
APIs.
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8:24 a.m.
New subject: No. 232 - indent-new-comment-line misbehaviour
Am Donnerstag, 13. März 2008 00:52 schrieb Stephen J. Turnbull:
Andreas Röhler writes:
> Or: Why not make the basement of this marvellous
> universe of code a little bit more reliable?
Because Richard Stallman likes it the way it is. Look up the history
of `split-string'. He absolutely insisted on special-casing the
default case because that's what a hacker would want most of the time.
This kind of thing happens all the time.
We're constrained by compatibility with split-string and other common
APIs.
I'll have a look at it. For the moment I see that many
important things to do which are purely XEmacs:
installation difficulties, memory leaks, redundancies,
missing char classes etc. I'll be happy if that kind of
a barrier you mentioned will be left.
Nonewithstanding XEmacs must not sync up with bugs or
unconveniences as in commenting.
Let's take it.
Andreas Röhler
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9:13 p.m.
New subject: No. 232 - indent-new-comment-line misbehaviour
Andreas Röhler writes:
I'll have a look at it. For the moment I see that many important
things to do which are purely XEmacs: installation difficulties,
Such as?
memory leaks,
That would be greatly appreciated. I believe XEmacs *was* pretty
tight until the introduction of the new GC algorithms (called "KKCC"
in messages, configuration, and documentation), and the generational
GC. So that is probably the best place to look for those. Look for
messages and ChangeLogs by Marcus Crestani ("crestani" in commit
messages, I believe) as being especially relevant. Jerry James has
also been active in leak-plugging, but he does a number of things so
his commits are not as good an indicator of a particular topic. Both
Jerry and Marcus have posted recently so once you are ready to study
they would probably be able to help answer questions (Marcus about GC
and Jerry more about various tools to instrument XEmacs for catching
leaks etc).
redundancies,
Many of these are due to GNU reimplementing XEmacs features
differently (with different names). While cleaning them up would be
nice, often such patches cause subtle behavior changes that are very
annoying to users. Be careful.
missing char classes etc.
Please don't do that now, unless you want it so bad you're willing to
do it again later. We really need to convert to Unicode internally,
and soon. That will very likely involve extensive changes to code
involving char classes, especially regular expressions.
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10:11 p.m.
New subject: No. 232 - indent-new-comment-line misbehaviour
On Thu, Mar 13, 2008 at 3:13 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull <stephen(a)xemacs.org> wrote:
That would be greatly appreciated. I believe XEmacs *was* pretty
tight until the introduction of the new GC algorithms (called "KKCC"
in messages, configuration, and documentation), and the generational
GC. So that is probably the best place to look for those. Look for
messages and ChangeLogs by Marcus Crestani ("crestani" in commit
messages, I believe) as being especially relevant. Jerry James has
also been active in leak-plugging, but he does a number of things so
his commits are not as good an indicator of a particular topic.
Translation: "He's all over the map."
Jack-of-all-trades-but-master-of-none-ly yours,
--
Jerry "Say that with a grin" James
http://loganjerry.googlepages.com/
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2:13 a.m.
New subject: No. 232 - indent-new-comment-line misbehaviour
on 03/13/2008 03:11 PM Jerry James said the following:
Translation: "He's all over the map."
Jack-of-all-trades-but-master-of-none-ly yours,
Nah. It's more like "Let's parachute JJ in and see if he can knock
some sense into those rebels. He's done it before."
I appreciate wide-ranging interests.
--- Vladimir
--
Vladimir G. Ivanovic
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Vladimir G. Ivanovic