Re: Yeah! Using instructions missing from the README, xemacs installed! (was Re: How can xemacs have been made so hard to install? Do the developers have any clue it is needlessly hard/undocumented?)

Unfortunately, you are very right about the current situation of things. In my opinion, the creation of the package system has really been a big disaster. The only things that packages seem to gain are a certain amount of disk space (which is essentially free nowadays and not worth saving), and some possible savings in download time (which is completely outweighed by the incredible headache that you have to go through in order to get things working). Before the implementation of the package system, there was one tarball for everything, and installation was easy, following the standard "configure; make; make install" paradigm. Nowadays, it is a big mess, which is compounded by the fact that the package system has not been completed and is often left in a semi-broken state, and by the fact that the current maintainers do not seem interested in putting in the time to fix some of the basic problems with documentation, broken READMEs, a very out-of-date web site, etc. It is often claimed that "there is no time" to work on these things. This is obviously a bogus claim, however, because plenty of other things do get worked on, and most of these things are much less important (but often more interesting) than these basic maintenance issues. Unfortunately, this is often exactly how things go with free software projects. Unless the primary maintainer really cares about the basic upkeep of the external and/or "newbie" elements of the project (which the current maintainer obviously does not care about), the external state of the project tends to decay, and lead to deplorable situations like what we currently have. Ben Wing Hans> If you guys could put the contents of Jan's simple instructions in the README, boy, Hans> it would be nice.... Hans> I know people (serious programmers short on time) who simply gave up on installing Hans> xemacs.... Hans> The lack of instructions on where things get untarred were much worse than the number Hans> of tarballs, but I still think you should also offer an xemacs-everything.tgz Hans> Hans Hans> Jan Vroonhof wrote: Hans> Without documentation of it, a feature does not exist. It does no good for me to not Hans> need the files if I am not told this. Hans> But actually, it was not the number of tarballs but the lack of instruction on where Hans> they go that stopped me. Hans> It is NOT obvious where sumo goes. Hans> Thanks. Why don't you guys put the contents of this on the web page where it will be Hans> seen before downloading. Hans> Note that when I read it I am not sure if I need the info and elc files to get Hans> everything or if they will merely shorten my compile time. You could make this Hans> clear, such that someone can quickly determine what to download if they want Hans> everything, and what to type to make it build. Hans> I did use Sumo. That left me having to download 5 tar balls, and having no Hans> instructions on what goes where (It has no README saying where it goes), and having Hans> to type something more complicated than "tar xfvz xemacs-everything.tgz; cd xemacs; Hans> ./configure; make; make install". Why? Why not just have one tarball for people Hans> like me, and then those of you with more time than RAM and disk can spend days Hans> picking and choosing to your heart's content? Hans> Nit: The web page says the current version is 21.1, but it looks like it is 21.1.4 to Hans> me.... Wouldn't it be better to either not say, or say in full, the name of the Hans> current version? Hans> What happened to that signatures index package? Did you guys take it off the site, Hans> or did I just forget where I saw it? Hans> Ok, so now I tried this set of commands Hans> [root＠localhost src]# \rm -r xemacs-21.1.4/ Hans> [root＠localhost src]# tar xfz old/xemacs-21.1.4.tar.gz Hans> [root＠localhost src]# tar xfz old/xemacs-21.1.4-info.tar.gz Hans> [root＠localhost src]# tar xfz old/xemacs-21.1.4-elc.tar.gz Hans> [root＠localhost src]# cd xemacs-21.1.4 Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# \rm -r /usr/local/lib Hans> here I ran ./configure, it asked for XPM, I installed XPM from your website, then I Hans> continued Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# ./configure Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# make Hans> Producing `src/Emacs.ad.h' from `etc/Emacs.ad'. Hans> Resetting `src/puresize-adjust.h'. Hans> Resetting `src/sheap-adjust.h'. Hans> cd ./lib-src && make CC='gcc' CFLAGS='-g -O3 -Wall -Wno-switch' LDFLAGS='' Hans> CPPFLAGS='' all Hans> make[1]: Entering directory `/usr/src/xemacs-21.1.4/lib-src' Hans> gcc -g -O3 -Wall -Wno-switch -Demacs -I../src -DHAVE_CONFIG_H Hans> /usr/src/xemacs-21.1.4/lib-src/make-path.c -o make-path Hans> In file included from /usr/include/bits/errno.h:25, Hans> from /usr/include/errno.h:36, Hans> from /usr/src/xemacs-21.1.4/lib-src/make-path.c:36: Hans> /usr/include/linux/errno.h:4: asm/errno.h: No such file or directory Hans> make[1]: *** [make-path] Error 1 Hans> make[1]: Leaving directory `/usr/src/xemacs-21.1.4/lib-src' Hans> make: *** [lib-src] Error 2 Hans> If you guys aspire to configuration perfection, may I suggest you teach configure to Hans> look for asm in /usr/src/linux and warn about it? So I created a link from Hans> /usr/src/linux to a working kernel, and continued (asm is in the kernel source).... Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# make clean Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# make Hans> boy, you guys sure ought to clean up a lot of warnings, you know, just so you'll Hans> notice if there is a warning that is significant.... Hans> but it worked. Then I did: Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# make install Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs-21.1.4]# cd /usr/local/lib/xemacs Hans> [root＠localhost xemacs]# tar xfvz /usr/src/old/xemacs-sumo.tar.gz Hans> and everything seems to work. Yeah! I love vm, and compiling my code using xemacs, Hans> and.... Hans> Thanks much, Hans> Hans Hans> PS Hans> I didn't get a chance to try out this script Eric sent me, but thanks for sending the Hans> script. Maybe the developers of xemacs might take a look at it. Hans> #!/bin/csh -fx Hans> # Hans> # xemacs.csh Hans> # Hans> # Auto Configure, Make & Install for XEmacs Hans> # Written by Eric Veum <sysv(a)yahoo.com&gt; Hans> # Hans> # Comments/Usage: Hans> # An automatic recompilation system for XEmacs. Insert all Hans> # the listed packages and this shell script as Hans> # Hans> # Partitioned XEmacs System Hans> # Hans> # $prefix/src/{xemacs.csh,*.tar.gz} Archive Source Location Hans> # /{bin,man,lib} Installation Location Hans> # Hans> # Additional File Requirements: Hans> # texinfo-3.12.tar.gz # TeXInfo (makeinfo reqired by XEmacs Hans> compiliation) Hans> # jpeg-6b.tar.gz # JPEG (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> # zlib-1.1.3.tar.gz # ZLib (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> # libpng-1.0.3.tar.gz # LibPNG (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> # xpm-3.4k.tar.gz # XPM (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> # tiff-3.4.tar.gz # TIFF Library (Optional Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> # xemacs-21.1.4.tar.gz # XEmacs (Installable Package) Hans> # xemacs-sumo.tar.gz # XEmacs Sumo (Installable ELisp Component) Hans> # ispell-3.1.20.tar.gz # ISpell (Optional Installable Package) Hans> # Hans> # Running this script will automatically compile any optional Hans> # library packages statically required for linking, as well as Hans> # perform a temporary install of any compilation dependent Hans> # packages required for compilation. Hans> # Hans> # Archive Source Prefix Independent of Calling Prefix Hans> set prog = $0 Hans> if( $prog:h == $prog ) then Hans> set arcsrcprefix = $cwd # In Archive Source Already Hans> else Hans> set arcsrcprefix = $prog:h # Not in Archive Source Hans> endif Hans> # Goto Archive Source Prefix Hans> pushd $arcsrcprefix > /dev/null Hans> # Installation Prefix (Parent of Archive Source Prefix) Hans> set prefix = $arcsrcprefix:h Hans> # Dependent Packages Location Hans> # (Temporary Installation Only during Compile) Hans> set tmpprefix = $prefix/tmp Hans> # XEmacs build Dependent Packages Hans> set srctexi = texinfo-3.12 # TeXInfo (makeinfo reqired by XEmacs Hans> compiliation) Hans> # XEmacs Optional Packages Hans> set srcjpg = jpeg-6b # JPEG (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> set srczlib = zlib-1.1.3 # ZLib (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> set srcpng = libpng-1.0.3 # LibPNG (Optional Static Library Used Hans> in Compile Only) Hans> set srcxpm = xpm-3.4k # XPM (Optional Static Library Used in Hans> Compile Only) Hans> set srctiff = tiff-3.4 # TIFF Library (Optional Library Used Hans> in Compile Only) Hans> set srcxemacs = xemacs-21.1.4 # XEmacs (Installable Package) Hans> set srcsumo = xemacs-sumo # XEmacs Sumo (Installable Component) Hans> set srcispell = ispell-3.1.20 # ISpell (Optional Installable Package) Hans> # Optional Configure Flags For XEmacs Hans> set xeflags = '--cflags=-O --with-tooltalk=no --with-sparcworks=no Hans> --with-workshop=no --with-sound=no --with-site-lisp' Hans> set siteprefixes = Hans> ${prefix}/src/${srcjpg}:${prefix}/src/${srczlib}:${prefix}/src/${srcpng}:${prefix}/src/${srcxpm}:${prefix}/src/${srctiff} Hans> # Extract, Compile TeXInfo Hans> set src = $srctexi # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> configure --prefix=$tmpprefix # Configure Hans> make # Make Hans> make install # Install Hans> popd > /dev/null Hans> # Add Build Dependents to Path Hans> set path = ( $prefix/tmp/bin $path ); rehash Hans> # Extract, Compile JPEG Hans> set src = $srcjpg # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> configure # Configure Hans> make # Compile Hans> if ( ! -e include ) then Hans> ln -s . include # Dummy Install on Itself Hans> endif Hans> mkdir -p lib ; mv libjpeg.a lib/libjpeg.a Hans> popd > /dev/null # Return to Storage Dir Hans> # Extract, Compile ZLIB Hans> set src = $srczlib # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> configure # Configure Hans> make # Compile Hans> if ( ! -e include ) then Hans> ln -s . include # Dummy Install on Itself Hans> endif Hans> mkdir -p lib ; mv libz.a lib/libz.a Hans> popd > /dev/null # Return to Storage Dir Hans> # Extract, Compile PNGLIB, Needs ZLIB Headers Hans> set src = $srcpng # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> cp scripts/makefile.std ./Makefile # Create Makefile Hans> make "CFLAGS = -O -I../$srczlib/include" libpng.a # Compile Hans> if ( ! -e include ) then Hans> ln -s . include # Dummy Install on Itself Hans> endif Hans> mkdir -p lib ; mv libpng.a lib/libpng.a Hans> popd > /dev/null # Return to Storage Dir Hans> # Extract, Compile Xpm Hans> set src = $srcxpm # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> xmkmf ; make Makefiles # Create Makefiles Hans> make includes ; make depend ; make # Compile Hans> # Eliminate Shared Object Library, and Create Static Library Hans> rm lib/libXpm.so* ; cd lib ; ar -rv libXpm.a *.o ; cd .. Hans> # Create Standard Setup for Headers Hans> mkdir -p include/X11 ; cp lib/xpm.h include/X11/xpm.h Hans> popd > /dev/null Hans> # Extract, Compile LIBTIFF Hans> set src = $srctiff # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> configure --noninteractive # Configure Hans> make # Compile Hans> if ( ! -e include ) then Hans> ln -s libtiff include # Dummy Install on Itself Hans> endif Hans> mkdir -p lib ; mv libtiff/libtiff.a lib/libtiff.a Hans> popd > /dev/null # Return to Storage Dir Hans> # Extract, Compile XEmacs Hans> set src = $srcxemacs # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> # Configure Hans> configure --prefix=$prefix $xeflags --site-prefixes=$siteprefixes Hans> make # Compile Hans> make install # Install Hans> popd > /dev/null # Return to Storage Dir Hans> # Extract, Install LISP Packages Hans> set src = $srcsumo # PACKAGE w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> mkdir -p $prefix/lib/xemacs Hans> rm -rf $prefix/lib/xemacs/xemacs-packages # Remove Older Version so Hans> no overwrite as /xemacs-packages/xemacs-packages Hans> mv xemacs-packages $prefix/lib/xemacs/xemacs-packages Hans> # Extract, Compile Ispell Hans> set src = $srcispell # Source Code w/o Tar.gz/Z Hans> Extension Hans> gunzip -f -c $src.tar.gz | tar -xvpf - # Extract Hans> pushd $src > /dev/null # Goto Src Directory Hans> # Create SVS-V local.h with Installation $prefix Hans> sed "s＠PREFIX＠$prefix＠g" ../local.template.h > local.h Hans> make # Compile Hans> mkdir -p $prefix/man/man1 ; mkdir -p $prefix/man/man4 Hans> make install Hans> popd > /dev/null # Return to Storage Dir Hans> ## Clean Out All Sources & Temporary Dependent Packages Hans> rm -rf $tmpprefix ; rm -rf $srctexi Hans> rm -rf $srcjpg Hans> rm -rf $srczlib Hans> rm -rf $srcpng Hans> rm -rf $srcxpm Hans> rm -rf $srctiff Hans> rm -rf $srcxemacs Hans> rm -rf $srcsumo Hans> rm -rf $srcispell Hans> # End: Return to Original Calling Directory Hans> popd > /dev/null Hans> === Hans> US-Mail: Eric Veum, P.O. Box 131221, Ann Arbor, MI 48113 Hans> Home: 2313 Leslie Circle, Ann Arbor, MI 48105 Hans> Home Tel: 734-662-8180, Anytime, Voice-Mail Hans> Mobile: 619-884-6040, Anytime, Voice-Mail Hans> Work Tel: 734-994-1200x2398, 0900-1800 EST/EDT, Voice-Mail Hans> _____________________________________________________________ Hans> Do You Yahoo!? Hans> Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com Hans> -- Hans> Get Linux (http://www.kernel.org) plus ReiserFS Hans> (http://devlinux.org/namesys). If you sell an OS or Hans> internet appliance, buy a port of ReiserFS! If you Hans> need customizations and industrial grade support, we sell them.