Let's take this to xemacs-design. Reply-To and M-F-T set.
Aidan> Ar an tríú lá is fiche de mí Márta, scríobh Steve Youngs:
> > (t > (if (eq mail-user-agent
> (setq mail-user-agent 'vm-user-agent))) > (apply (get
> 'sendmail-user-agent 'composefunc) args)))
> Wanna know where this breaks down? With Sumo installers who
> don't like VM.
Aidan> [That last setq should have been (setq mail-user-agent
Aidan> 'sendmail-user-agent) . ]
Aidan> So, let’s say they have a new account on a remote machine,
Aidan> they fire up XEmacs with an empty ~/.xemacs/init.el, they
Aidan> type C-x m, and they have the same behaviour that they had
Aidan> in the past,
It doesn't work that way in practice. VM is pretty robust because
Kyle is so conservative, but large packages do break.
Aidan> but with the possibility of attaching files
Aidan> and having sane treatment of non-ASCII characters. The VM
Aidan> mail composition _is_ the sendmail.el composition function,
Aidan> _but with MIME._
Extra features also upset beginning users. Sane treatment of
non-ASCII characters is not yet really supported in XEmacs, and
specifically not in vanilla VM.
Granted, VM is a huge step forward over sendmail-user-agent, and it
really _should_ be available and recommended. But we can't force it
to be available, and although I think we should default to it when
available, the user should have the option to use something else.
> Getting back to mail-user-agent... IMO the default in XEmacs
> should be _very very_ basic, no bells or whistles, and
> definitely no need for MIME.
Aidan> I respectfully disagree. MIME is not a bell or a whistle.
That is true, but only so far as "Content-Type: text/plain;
charset=something-the-user-can-actually-write-in" is not otherwise
supported. Attachments etc _are_ bells and whistles. And since what
is needed in _core_ is the ability to send build and bug reports, it
is arguable that even MIME charset support is unnecessary.
If the user wants bells and whistles, they'll install something
like VM, Gnus, MH-E.
Now what would be cool is if the first time mail-user-agent is
and it has not been set...
Pop up a small help buffer saying something like:
You have the following XEmacs MUA's installed:
1 - Gnus -- The Gnus Newsreader and Mailreader.
2 - MH-E -- The XEmacs Interface to the MH Mail System.
3 - VM -- An Emacs mailer.
Default - Builtin, ASCII-only, no-frills mailer.
People sometimes get confused if you leave the default implicit. I
also think that instead of the package blurbs, we should use something
more descriptive and meaningful to novices:
You have the following XEmacs MUAs installed:
Default -- Builtin, ASCII-text-only, no-frills mailer.
(Suitable for bug reports.)
1 - Gnus -- Advanced MUA with powerful mail and netnews features.
2 - MH-E -- Powerful mail processing system. (Depends
on separate, properly configured MH installation.)
3 - VM -- Easy to use, full-featured mailer.
(NB, for ease of comparison I'm following Steve's outline here, I
really think default should be VM, with the other MUAs ordered Gnus,
Which do you want to use as your default mailer? (press num to
select MUA or RET to use the built-in basic mailer)
Then ask the user if they want this selection just for this session or
for all eternity. :-)
Aidan> I respectfully disagree. People have better things to do
Aidan> than choose among alternatives they neither know nor care
Aidan> about when they’re learning a new working environment.
This is the appropriate way to think about it, but I think that Steve
is right, because people _do_ care about the MUA. If our default
mailer could be Outhouse Excess compatible, that would be one thing.
But it can't (and you don't know how that relieves my mind!)
Furthermore, we already have the facility (novice.el) built-in, custom
already works this way, etc. It's not like new users can avoid such
choices until they reach Reviewer status! Like it or not, such
choices are part of the XEmacs working environment for the foreseeable
Aidan> And MH-E shouldn’t be in that list unless the mhparam
Aidan> command is available, which it won’t be.
Unless the user is already an MH user.
Anyway, (shell-command "which mhparam") :-)
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